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Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item

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Post by The Amethyst Dragon Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:44 pm

With today's recent reset, I added an item to the game that can be used once to let a PC redo his or her levels (except for 1st level, of course). It's a set of scales that when used, will jump your character to a special room in the game, drop his/her XP to 1 (reducing that character to 1st level), then restore it to what it was so the levels can be redone. If the levels are redone in the Re-Level Chamber, the character will not suffer the subrace XP penalties during the re-level process.

Characters will get this item twice during level-ups. Once at 2nd level (or higher if not a new character), and once upon hitting 20th level. Now, PCs can make changes in their character build without the aid of a DM, and without using Arkon.

Oh, and Arkon will no longer store XP beyond what is necessary for your current level, since his original function was never as a re-leveler.

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Post by MannyJabrielle Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:01 pm

Excellent Smile

So, now subraces can safely bank XP with Arkon without worrying that it will take them below their current level?
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Post by Maeglin Dubh Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:01 pm

So, I can now only re-level twice in my character's lifetime, and one of those times only after level 20?
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Post by RayvenNightkind Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:27 pm

So if we are already past lvl 20, should we expect to see both of these scales show up in our inventory after our next level up?
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:49 pm

If not, I imagine a DM can get them for you ... as long as you ask nicely! Razz
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Post by The Amethyst Dragon Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:09 pm

Maeglin Dubh wrote:So, I can now only re-level twice in my character's lifetime, and one of those times only after level 20?
That's right. Granted, in a real D&D game you wouldn't get to re-level at all. This way, you get two chances for your character to "turn back time", and you don't need a DM to do it for you, even if you have a subrace.

Arkon was never meant to be a means to constantly re-level, even with those without subraces. The ability to set you back levels was merely an oversight on my part when I scripted the XP banking.

RayvenNightkind wrote:So if we are already past lvl 20, should we
expect to see both of these scales show up in our inventory after our
next level up?
The next time you level up, you'll get both sets of scales. And you don't have to use them...they're just there for convenience. If you never want to use them, you can use the sacrificial flame on them.

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Post by MannyJabrielle Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:28 pm

How would a 40th level character go about getting a scale since he or she can't level up again?
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Post by daveyeisley Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:29 pm

I think this is a good change.

Well done The Amethyst Dragon. Smile

For folks who have used both of their relevels, and somehow STILL have some issue with their character, I dont think it is totally impossible that a DM would help with it again... but now we can be a little more strict on the reasons, etc... because you already had two goes around with it.
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Post by The Amethyst Dragon Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:48 pm

MannyJabrielle wrote:How would a 40th level character go about getting a scale since he or she can't level up again?
Ask a DM to take your current level away and then give it back to you. When you get your 40th level again, the script will give you both items.

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Post by MannyJabrielle Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:57 pm

K, danke Smile
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Post by RayvenNightkind Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:10 pm

The Amethyst Dragon wrote:
The next time you level up, you'll get both sets of scales. And you don't have to use them...they're just there for convenience. If you never want to use them, you can use the sacrificial flame on them.

Nope don't have to use 'em but it is a nice 'just in case' option! bounce
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Post by RustyDios Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:08 pm

Well I really like this little addition... even if I am a sucker for "it was your choice - live with it" ... It's a nice addition to those that want to re-level thier PC... and forces them to at least play untill 20th with their bad choices... ... my only question now is.. will this get abused?... work at a 20th level Ftr, "re-lev" 19 levs of Ftr (saved skill point dump into) 1 Rog... .... it's a good item an always a great idea if your PC is stopping your enjoyment of the fun -- but I think we also need that "spend all your skill points at this level-up or lose them" option brought in... ....

.. In my opinion it should not be allowed anyway, so its good The Amethyst Dragon is catering to all that play in Aenea.. the original DnD got called "PEN and paper",, not " PENCIL, Eraser and Scratchpad" ... ..

.. anyway at its core NWN is just a Computer Game that people want to excel at, regardless how close to PnP we can get it... ...

... though I don't agree with the idea, it's still a nice touch...

... I'll be sticking with my overly flawed, comletely non-optimised, random choice at each level, "because that's what they would/should have learned", I'm going to die again because that last feat is completely useless in Aenea, flawed, interesting and difficult but fun PC's to play with.... ..... a characters biggest traight may be thier greatess weakness ...... ..... HAIL THE TWINS !!
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:59 pm

Indeed, RustyDios, hail the Twins! Cool
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Post by MannyJabrielle Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:17 pm

Also, an option, if one wants to get the precise build in a character, use the aenea builder's module. None of the custom spells or feats will actually do anything in the module, but they'll be available for selection at level up so you can figure them into your build.
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Post by daveyeisley Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:54 pm

Well, I think I may have just thought of an exploit.

Exploits are bad.... so here is what I think might be an exploit:

I start levelling a new character with a subrace Xp penalty.

At some point, I start banking all my XP. Every time I would have enough to level, I bank it... so I dont level.

Eventually I have a whole crapload of XP banked. Up to this point, I dont think its an exploit... but...

Now, I go to arkon, and ask for all that XP back.

Then, before I actually do any level ups, I use the re-levelling scales.

I go to the re-levelling chamber, get bumped down to level 1, and get all my XP back.... and now I can level up a whole bunch of time without EVER paying the XP penalties for my subrace.
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Post by DerusTal Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:56 pm

Is it bad that my first thought upon reading that was "Awesome."?
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Post by RustyDios Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:49 pm

Wow... that's a rather intricate way of the above mentioned "abuse of the system"... ... would really negate the point of the sub-race xp penalty to balance out all those cool features the sub-races give you.. ...
... definately an exploit.. a big exploit...

.. bigger then the one I had come up in my head (which was entirely influenced by a different thread.. Smile )...

.. there must be a way around this.... or the optional path narrows very quickly to it's removal from the world.. Sad ... sad for all those that want/need/ like this option....
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Post by daveyeisley Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:15 pm

I think the fix is simple.... if you have enough Xp to level up, but havent actually DONE it.... then the scales wont work if you try top use them... problem solved... if The Amethyst Dragon can get it to work like that.
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Post by daveyeisley Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:19 pm

DerusTal wrote:Is it bad that my first thought upon reading that was "Awesome."?

I dont think its bad... no.... in a twisted way, I am proud that my brain came up with that... I think outside the box, as it were.


But, I also think it would be bad to take advantage of it... its totally against what was intended....so, The Amethyst Dragon needs to know about it so he can fix it (this is assuming he hadnt already thought of it and put a preventive measure in place)
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:10 am

From what I understand, The Amethyst Dragon was going to place a limit on Akron's xp storing ability, so that you could only store one level's worth of experience. I believe that he referenced that at the top of this thread (that's why I couldn't find it!). Killing the exploit for re-leveling, I understand, will also render daveyeisley's genius thought null and void. Laughing
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Post by daveyeisley Tue Nov 04, 2008 9:43 am

I dont think thats what The Amethyst Dragon meant when he said Arkon won't store more Xp than what is needed for your current level.

Arkon used to take 10%, no matter what, even if that meant you would LOSE a level. I believe The Amethyst Dragon meant Arkon will no longer do this. Your current level will no longer be removed.

Having a limit to your total XP you can bank sort of defeats the purpose. The bank you deposit your paycheck into is never going to say "Hey, your account is full... you can't put anymore in". Cuz that would be silly, and you would go get an account somehwere else.
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Post by daveyeisley Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:00 pm

If you can spare the time, The Amethyst Dragon, it would be nice to have a clarification on this issue, please.
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Post by The Amethyst Dragon Tue Nov 04, 2008 2:25 pm

I have a minute. Smile Arkon will be able to hold any amount of XP, but the re-level scales will not work if you have enough XP to level up already (at least, they function that way after the next reset).

Arkon doesn't take XP for banking beyond what you need to keep your current level.

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Post by daveyeisley Tue Nov 04, 2008 3:46 pm

My thanks to you sir. Smile
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:44 pm

Thanks to you both for setting me straight. Mechanics was never my strong suite ... Cool
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Post by daveyeisley Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:47 pm

Well, mechanics may be something I gravitate to.... but you have more enthusiasm and positive outlook than almost anybody I have ever met Smile

My hat goes off to you, Eric cheers
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:55 pm

Well, thank you, daveyeisley! Honestly, I'm at a loss for words (a difficult feat in front of a keyboard, mind you)! Embarassed Laughing Cool
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Post by Kefrem Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:42 pm

Can i suggest a conversation option with this doodad? i went to drag it to my last inventory slot and it fired off and i lost it at level 3 right after i had made my latest toon Sad

the ...Are you sure you wish to use this item yes?/no?
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Post by MannyJabrielle Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:57 pm

toon?
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Post by Eric of Atrophy Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:26 pm

Different slang for player character. I'm used to PC, myself, but to each his own!
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Post by MannyJabrielle Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:36 pm

Oh, like cartoon?
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Time Zone : GMT -5:00(EST)
Registration date : 2008-07-05

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Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item Empty Re: Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item

Post by The Amethyst Dragon Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:16 pm

Kefrem wrote:Can i suggest a conversation option with this doodad? i went to drag it to my last inventory slot and it fired off and i lost it at level 3 right after i had made my latest toon Sad

the ...Are you sure you wish to use this item yes?/no?
You'll get another one at 20th level, but if you think you'll need it, ask a DM very nicely and you may just get a replacement. Be careful with any inventory item...how'd you activate it just dragging inventory around, anyway?

Not going to add a conversation option, since that's a few more resources added on the module (at least the conversation file and a paired script file (.ncs and .nss)).

_________________
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------------------------------------- The Amethyst Dragon -------------------------------------
Creator of Aenea | Custom Content Maker | Dungeon Master | Builder | Scripter | Writer | Player | Sleepless
The Amethyst Dragon
The Amethyst Dragon
Ludicrous Level
Ludicrous Level

. : Creator of Aenea / Dungeon Master
Male Number of posts : 7840
Age : 47
Location : probably on the computer or wrangling his offspring
NWN Username : amethystdragon
DM Name : The Amethyst Dragon
Time Zone : GMT - 6:00 (Wisconsin)
Registration date : 2008-06-02

http://www.amethyst-dragon.com/nwn

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Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item Empty Re: Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item

Post by MannyJabrielle Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:35 pm

The gods are fickle, and might strike us down out of whim or whimsey then Very Happy Boom! geek
MannyJabrielle
MannyJabrielle
Ludicrous Level
Ludicrous Level

. : Dungeon Master
Male Number of posts : 5927
Main Character : See the "A-Team" thread in the Biographies forum.
DM Name : Dungeon-Master Gaelen
Time Zone : GMT -5:00(EST)
Registration date : 2008-07-05

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Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item Empty Re: Nov. 3: Character Re-Level Item

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