Epic Magic Bugs (merged threads)

[MannyJabrielle]

Yeah, the epic spells are very wonky with who they'll work for. My druid Alex can only cast of of his (an AC buffer seed) on himself while he's shapeshifted into dragonshape. When shapeshifted into any other form, or in his natural shape, the DC passes, but no effect places. It doesn't work on other creatures at all either (just a straight unmodified seed, no restrictions or such)

[daveyeisley]

updated later in thread

[MannyJabrielle]

The "spells just don't work" thing is roughly 50% with my characters :-/ Aga seems to be the worst off, not one of his epic spells works, and his casts per day are the most flubbed as well (only getting 3 casts per day, should be getting twice that).

[evilkittenofdoom]

I know for a fact that Instant Kill, as well as Kill + Raise is busted. The rest of mine work, but I haven't done all *that* much as I haven't decided which ones I want yet

[A_Vagabond]

My epic caster can successfully only cast one epic spell out of three researched, and that one only works on someone else, not himself. Casting counts are messed up as mentioned earlier, and he, too, couldn't use ;;em commands until after the reset following his achievement of epic level.

Just another data point.

[daveyeisley]

updated later in thread

[MannyJabrielle]

I've been messing around with several characters, and I don't think the spellcraft checks are being calculated right for anyone, not just wizards.

Five examples, Aurora (sorc), Aga, Angelica, and Auger (wizards), and Aerith (cleric).

The following are all for "out of combat" checks, which should be "take 20" if I read the related posts correctly).

Aurora: 152 epic spell casting check. she has 114 modified spellcraft, +10 mystical insight bonus and a 16 ability modifier. Her epic spellcraft check, with take 20 should be 160

Aga: 109 epic spell casting check. He has 100 modified spellcraft, +10 mystical insight bonus and a 21 ability modifier. His epic spellcraft check with take 20 should be 151.

Angelica: 98 epic spell casting check. She has 78 modified spellcraft, +10 mystical insight bonus and a +10 ability modifier. Her epic spellcraft check with take 20 should be 118.

Auger: 112 epic spellcasting check. He has 82 modified spellcraft, +10 mystical insight bonus and a +11 ability modifier. His epic spellcraft check with take 20 should be 123.

Aerith: 121 epic spell casting check. She has 81 modified spellcraft, +10 mystical insight bonus and a 13 ability modifier. Her epic spellcraft check with take 20 should be 124.

From what the numbers are showing though, there's no take 20.

I would have thought that it's doing a 1d20 on the check rather than a take 20, BUT, the numbers are 100% consistent (Aurora's is always 12 more than her modified epic spellcraft score, Aerith's is always 17 more, Aga's is always 22 less, Angie's is always 20 less, and Auger's is always 21 less). There's no variation, and the difference between what the check actually is and what it should be isn't a consistent number either, which makes it hard to tell what is actually happening.

[MannyJabrielle]

On a side note, with casts per day, Auger's casts aren't being calculated right, but unlike everyone else, he consistently gets more casts than he's supposed to (or rather, his counter lists 7 casts per day.... with that last one always being broke, he's actually getting the correct 6 casts per day for his build (+1 cast from 30 PM, +1 from 10 wizard, +4 from spellcraft).

[MannyJabrielle]

Edit: Tested Alex as well (druid). His epic spellcrafting check (assuming take 20) and his casts per day are correct for his stats (the counter on the casts that is, not counting that last one that always fizzles).

[daveyeisley]

For the spellcraft checks for your non-wizards, remember to subtract their INT from their modified spellcraft bonus, then add feats, and ability mods.

This may end up making the test results seem more broken, but otherwise the expected check values would be including two stat modifiers for non-wizards.

[MannyJabrielle]

I'm not sure if it does subtract, or should subtract even....

What it should be is:

For sorcs, clerics druids (and PM/Sorc multi class) - Modified Spellcraft + MI feat (if applicable) + wis or cha mod.

For wizards - Modified spellcraft + MI feat (if applicable) + int modifier (essentially, they get their int modifier bonus again towards the epic spellcasting/researching check as they should be)

[MannyJabrielle]

EDIT: Yeah, looked it up, the way described it in the "out of character" forum thread is for non-wizards it removes the int modifer and replaces it with their casting stat modifier.

HOWEVER, I think it should still be the method I said in the previous post (non-wizards get modified spellcraft + casting modifer, wizards get modified plus int modifier (or basically, their INT is applied twice).

EITHER way gives the same result, except my method gives a higher check to PCs, which can help with achieving the insane base seed DCs

[MannyJabrielle]

Another edit... just noticed, the numbers I posted above seem to be including a take 20... Aga's "in combat" spellcraft checks are 89 consistently.

(and on the "spells dun werk" theme, his AC boost spell doesn't work on him or his familiar, but works fine on his golems)

[daveyeisley]

I certainly wouldnt mind wizards getting their INT bonus twice... but I would much rather see the seed DCs be tweaked to be more accomodating for non-maxxed out casters.... so that being maxxed out means having a lot more freedom to customize.

[evilkittenofdoom]

I concur on both points, sir Dave.

I'll check when I get home, but I believe I'm making some sort of variance with my checks when I cast during combat, as shown by my failing my teleport other, unwilling in combat once but succeeding on the next cast. So, that may make finding the combat rolls issue a little easier (or harder, but hey )

[daveyeisley]

Another little note. Doing the math, It seems that while spellcraft skill, like all other skills, being capped at 127 modified check, in spellcraft's case, actually is not attainable without stat mods (or maybe a buff like bard song).

I see 43 base ranks, 50 from skill bonuses from in-game item upgrades (not counting custom items because the seed DC should not be set with custom gear in mind, in-game upgrades is as far as that should ever go), 10 from Epic Skill Focus, 3 from Skill Focus, and maybe 2 from Courteous Mageocracy.

So all in all, without stat mod, spellcraft truly maxxes at 108, and really its more 106 if the player didn't know to take Courteous Mageocracy at 1st level (no way I ever could have known to do that with Crid because he was made before the Aenean Epic Spell system).

So being "maxxed" out on spell craft would mean that if the highest base DC were 100, that character would still need burns for most modifications.

[MannyJabrielle]

I consider dwarf/maker upgrades as completely in the same category as custom voucher gear in regards to spellcraft boosts. To me, making them considered "part of what a player can do to achieve this gameplay aspect" would make me feel totally obligated to do maker upgrades. I do the maker upgrades as a bonus, not an obligation, just as I consider the dwarf upgrades as a complete bonus, not obligatory.

[daveyeisley]

Dont get me wrong, I would prefer they not be included, too. But then we have seeds being balanced for a max spellcraft skill of only 56 or 58.

[MannyJabrielle]

Na, wouldn't be *that* low.

43 base spellcraft + mistical insight bonus + epic spellcraft focus + spellcraft focus + casting modifier. Assume non subraced human, with 18 starting casting stat. 28 casting stat at level 40 with no great wis/cha/int feats. +2 books are rare, but totally findable, as is +12 total enhancement gear.... so 42 casting stat, 16 modifier.

43+10+10+3+16 = 82.

There are a handful of items in-game too that have spellcraft boosts. Flow watcher staff, rare, but in-game, adds +15. Gloves of spellcraft focus, +3, those are available from shops. Ring of magical defences, +2 I think, maybe +3.

Overall, +82, without DM assistance, is completely doable. Without items, just a base naked character, it's still +70 (and yeah, it's not much higher than 58, but it's still a bit higher, so a realistic goal of "attainable seed DC's doesn't have to go down too low)

[daveyeisley]

I wasnt including the 2 books or the 12 enhancement, or casting stat at all, really. I was mainly demonstrating that without casting stat, you cannot max out spellcraft without custom items or DM upgrades.

I agree feats, and some in-game items can help.... but for instance, that flow watcher's staff? So rare it shouldn't be considered, as not everyone will ever find one.

I also dont think tomes should be included, honestly, and its only a 1 spellcraft from a 2 tome, so thats negligible.

43 ranks 10 epic spellcraft focus 3 Spellcraft focus 10 mystical insight = 66 without casting stat

With a 40 stat mod (I will grant you just about everybody should be able to pull that off) you get another 15.

So, 81. Sure, that isnt too bad.

[MannyJabrielle]

Yeah, I'm not saying the flowwater is *required*, but it's an option in-game that doesn't require DM assistance.

And don't get me wrong either, not like I'm saying DM upgrades should be *as rare* or something... rather I'd just shy away from them being considered "what any character can get" due to our time issues as assistant dm's... be it we're on haitus from the game for a while, or whatever.

But yes, I am in complete agreement that the base seed DCs are too high to be practical :-O

[daveyeisley]

updated later in thread

[eeriegeek]

hey dave, I reported some somewhere a while back but I'll re-iterate um here since it looks like yer undertaking the task of monitoring um These are from Amaerillie (wiz(38),clr(1),rog(1))

- could never get the trigger for the philosoper stone to fire

- incorrect # of epic casts (should be 3 (levels) + 4 (spellcraft) = 7) she gets only 4. also as above, incorrect counting of the 4 casts (4 is shown but the last one won't cast) (off by 1 error?)

- align portal with dark realms seed, the list says spellcraft 27 but was DC 60 when chosen from the pillar. she chose to adjust the DC with a BoM and 95% hp loss for a final DC of 30. when cast on a portal control, the spell casting effect fires, and the loss of hp is effected. There is a message "Check: Blood of Magic" but no BoM is actually lost.
The portal appears uneffected.

- damage reduction (30) (silent) - the spell casting effect fires, but the spell never effects the caster when self is targeted. The spell effects others sometimes and sometimes it does nothing, even when cast on the same PC at different times.

- slay living seed has no effect as above.

- improved invisibility seed has no effect targeted on self. targeted at others, it fires the impact effect and _may_ effect others.

- transform ghost form seed has no effect

- invisible + conceal seed has no effect on the caster

- create BoM seed does nothing if targeted on the caster, targeting the floor nearby does work.

- immunity to 1st level spells has no effect on the caster

- also gets the "wrong type of caster" message for elemental damage and shield pillars

[daveyeisley]

updated later in thread

[Eric of Atrophy]

Jane can't target herself for spell purposes, either. She also had an issue with the acid damage seed not doing anything - more investigation is needed.

[daveyeisley]

updated later in thread

[MannyJabrielle]

I've had the BoM one work for caster when the caster is targetted. It's a 50/50 chance of it working at all though.

[daveyeisley]

List of Issues:

Seed and modification DC could still use tweaking/lowering.

Casts per day seems incorrect/broken for many characters, multiclassing seems to have something to do with it, but not in all cases.

Even pure class casters with max spellcraft ranks are not getting 8 full casts/day, the last use gives an error about not being able to cast more epic magic.

Casts per day are not refreshing over time, they only come back from resting

The epic-casting nexus/focus item is very busticated as it regards targeting. It seems it cannot target creatures or objects, only the ground.

When casting epic spells in combat, a phantom -20 penalty is being applied to the roll.

The ;;em take 10 command is being set by default and will not toggle off.

Permanent spells are wearing off on their own, even without renewal or resting.

Epic spell effects are being dispelled by Beholders, as well as Mordenkainen's Disjunction. Mord's can break artifacts in PnP (although with an extremely poor success rate), so it having a 25% chance or so to dispel epic magic makes sense, but it certainly shouldn't be reliable. As for beholders, because their antimagic is supposed to only suppress magic, but can't be coded to do so properly, I think it is fair to make epic magic unaffected by their antimagic.

Derik Aerlias reported that he was getting the "You do not have the proper epic caster class for that effect" when trying to select the energy damage seeds, or the damage shield seeds. He is a multiclass ranger/wizard/monk.

At least one PC is unable to use certain epic spells unless shapeshifted.

Several PCs are unable to cast at least one (sometimes several or even all) of their epic spells on themself, they work only on other targets.

Amaerillie (wiz(38),clr(1),rog(1)) (and many other PCs) could never get the trigger for the philosopher stone to fire.

It seems that some characters who gain the Epic Magic feat are unable to use the ;;em commands until a server reset occurs. This makes them unable to research or cast any epic magic until that time. It happened to Gabriel, Auger, Aerith, Aurora, Axel, Angelica, Ahriman and possibly others.

Some epic spells are sometimes failing to cast, even when the spellcraft roll is clearly successful. Last night, Gabriel cast 4 different epic spells at least 4 times each(resting in between of course), and made the spellcraft checks on every single one, but the spells would only properly take effect less than 25% of the time. This was all tested out of combat, as well. Many characters are reporting similar issues.

Instant Kill seed and the Kill and Animate seeds are not working.

Destroy seed (even the 70d6 version) currently less effective than non-epic magics. More info.

Align portal with Dark Realm seed, the list says spellcraft 27 but was DC 60 when chosen from the pillar. Amaerillie (wiz(38),clr(1),rog(1)) chose to adjust the DC with a BoM and 95% hp loss for a final DC of 30. When cast on a portal control, the spell casting effect fires, and the loss of hp is effected. There is a message "Check: Blood of Magic" but no BoM is actually lost. The portal appears uneffected.

Damage Reduction (30) (silent) - the spell casting effect fires, but the spell never effects the caster when self is targeted. The spell effects others sometimes and sometimes it does nothing, even when cast on the same PC at different times. (note: Damage Resistance 40 works on self for Crideas)

Slay Living seed has no effect as above.

Improved Invisibility seed has no effect targeted on self. Targeted at others, it fires the impact effect and may effect others.

Transform Ghost form seed has no effect

Conceal: Invisibility seed has no effect on the caster

Create Blood of Magic seed does nothing if targeted on the caster, targeting the floor nearby does work. (note: This seed works for Crideas when targeting self or the ground. Seems to be a 50/50 chance of success for most casters.)

Immunity to Level 1 Spells seed has no effect on the caster.

Multiple PCs (mostly Arcane Casters) also get the "wrong type of caster" message for Elemental Damage and Shield seed pillars.

Acid Damage seed seems to not be doing anything when cast for some PCs.

[MannyJabrielle]

Just got epic magic and a spell with my pixie wizard.

Her spellcraft is 53 without her flowwatcher staff. Her spell's DC is 46. She rolls a consistent 43 though, which seems to be that the d20 roll is SUBTRACTING from her epic spellcrafting check rather than adding to it.

Also her casts per day are not right. 21 wizard with 24 spellcraft should be 4 casts per day. Her epic spellcasting counter shows 2, one of which is bugged and doesn't work as per every other epic caster.

And then the spell itself just flat out doesn't work even when she pulls out her flowwatcher and passes the spellcraft check.

[titus]

hi-de-ho

ok, i've been trying out the epic spell system. i'm impressed w/the great level of detail that went into this [as usual] and it seems like a pretty neat system. there are a couple of bugs that have cropped up.

bug #1
no die roll is made when in combat.
expected behavior: according to the information page, the success of an epic spell is determined by the character's ranks in spellcraft, modified by the ability bonus on the character's PR and a d20 die roll. the character may also take 10 by entering ';;em take10', in which case the final score is determined by adding 10 to modified spellcraft rather than a random 1-20.
observed behavior: nothing is ever added to the modified spellcraft score. ';;em take10' is uneffective. this results in spells failing because the final score is always lower than the score needed.

bug #2
the character may not cast the correct number of spells.
expected behavior: the character should be able to cast TRUNC( s / 10 ) + TRUNC( l / 10 ) epic spells per day, where s = base ranks in spellcraft and l = caster level.
observed behavior: my character has 26 base ranks in spellcraft at 23rd level, for a total of 4 spells allowed. in fact, the epic spell menu radial element shows correctly that 4 are available. unfortunately, once 3 spells are cast, the 4th spell always aborts w/the inexplicable message 'You do not have the ability to cast any epic spells at this time.' sadness reigns and visits to have cookies w/madame zolaras have been proved possible under these circumstances.

i hope these can be fixed, i'm really excited about using this system. i think the basic idea is awesome and it provides a long-needed extension to the nwn casting system.

[titus]

ok, i just discovered another bug. or maybe it's related to one of the other two. basically, i can't cast one of my new high-dc spells, even when i'm not in combat. also, unlike the other bug where i got the distinctive 'spell fails' sound fx, this one just out-and-out fails.

this spell uses the '+20 to armor ac' spell seed, dc 46. here is an excerpt from my player log:

Code:

[Wed Jan 25 12:08:45] Epic Spell Selected: Aegis of Ancients
[Wed Jan 25 12:08:58] Pin casts Epic Magic
[Wed Jan 25 12:08:58] Spellcraft: 59 vs. DC: 46
[Wed Jan 25 12:08:58] Pin: Aegis of Ancients!
[titus] Pin: [Talk] <c ¿þ>Aegis of Ancients!</c>
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:10] Pin casts Epic Magic
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:10] Spellcraft: 59 vs. DC: 46
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:10] Pin: Aegis of Ancients!
[titus] Pin: [Talk] <c ¿þ>Aegis of Ancients!</c>
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:28] Pin casts Epic Magic
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:28] Spellcraft: 59 vs. DC: 46
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:28] Pin: Aegis of Ancients!
[titus] Pin: [Talk] <c ¿þ>Aegis of Ancients!</c>
[Wed Jan 25 12:09:28] You have multiple items equipped or spell effects active that give an Armor AC bonus and the effects will not stack.


notice that i'm not in combat, and it takes 3 castings before the spell will actually work, even though my character's spellcraft beats the dc by a good margin.

[titus]

actually, the previous bug applies to all spells, not just high-dc spells. whenever pin tries to cast any epic magic, even if she's not in combat, the spell just randomly fails, even though the prerequisites are met.

[titus]

ha! the clever gnomes who run the game engine have obviously been busy on this and modestly not telling anyone they were working on it.

ok, i can verify that pin can now cast 4 spells instead of just 3. i'll test the rest of it today.

thanks, gnomes!

[titus]

oops, my bad. there's still at least one outstanding bug- the number of spells available. in fact pin is now granted 5 spells because her spellcraft has gone up, but she can cast only 4 spells. the epic spell radial correctly shows 1 spell still left, but at the point where the script should fire, i get the message 'You do not have the ability to cast any epic spells at this time.'

i'll test casting in combat later, have to wait a few hours before resting.

[titus]

well, unfortunately, epic magic still appears to be completely bugged.
- one fewer spell is granted than should be granted
- the 'take 10' effect has no effect, except maybe as the cause of spells inexplicably failing for no reason
- it doesn't appear that 'take10' is a toggle, because re-entering ';;em take10' does absolutely nothing to change the situation and there is no feedback in the chat window
- in combat, spells don't go off, even if the character's spellcraft exceeds the required dc
- out-of-combat casting seems more reliable ; today, 4 of the 5 spells pin should be able to use were castable out of combat, automatically taking 20. there have been other days when the spellcraft check for out-of-combat casting exceeds the required dc by 30 or more, and the spell still isn't cast.

any idea when (if?) this is going to be fixed? i've invested literally millions of gold a several levels-worth of xp in epic spells, only to find out the system is broken.

i have logs if they'll help track down the problem.

[daveyeisley]

You are not alone in your frustration.

[The Amethyst Dragon]

Even pure class casters with max spellcraft ranks are not getting 8 full casts/day, the last use gives an error about not being able to cast more epic magic.

Casts per day are not refreshing over time, they only come back from resting

When casting epic spells in combat, a phantom -20 penalty is being applied to the roll.

The ;;em take 10 command is being set by default and will not toggle off.

It seems that some characters who gain the Epic Magic feat are unable to use the ;;em commands until a server reset occurs. This makes them unable to research or cast any epic magic until that time. It happened to Gabriel, Auger, Aerith, Aurora, Axel, Angelica, Ahriman and possibly others.

Destroy seed (even the 70d6 version) currently less effective than non-epic magics. More info.

Slay Living seed has no effect as above.

Conceal: Invisibility seed has no effect on the caster


Some others may be fixed but are not yet tested. Working on more of these today and the next few days, doing multiple fixes then testing them on the server.

I'm also going to see about streamlining the research portion of the system so that instead of going from room to room to room and "using" placeables, it can be done like the newer item modification system where only the placeables immediatly useable are visible, and just clicking on them (rather than "using" them) will make the choices (so no having to walk to every placeable to make choices).

[titus]

w00t! awesome news, . reeeeally looking fwd to playing more w/this once it's all ironed out.

[daveyeisley]

Trying not to get too excited...

[The Amethyst Dragon]

That poor otter outside the library has been killed at least a dozen times today...

[Eric of Atrophy]

Casts per day are not refreshing over time, they only come back from resting

I'd check this one if I were you, , because it seems to have gone the other way - if my testing is correct, once logging into the server, there is now no limit to the amount of casts per day. I just had Jane cast and cast and cast and cast ... even changed up the spells she cast (and accidentally killed her in the process [oops! forgot which slot was 'Renewal of Life!' and which was 'Shock Tongue!']), and it made no difference ... never saw the 'can't cast any more spells' message we used to get.

[daveyeisley]

I tested and when I run out of epic magic, the icon on my quickslot goes gray and cannot be used anymore. It does replenish a single use after a while, however, and then can be used 1 more time. if i wait longer, I cna accrue a few uses... but it does run out for me like it is supposed to.

I am not sure if you are using the epic magic feat for casting or not. If you are casting it a different way somehow, I could try to test that.

If this gets looked at, it would be great to also have a look at the Epic Magic Nexus casting item, and see if the targeting issues can be fixed.

[titus]

Casts per day are not refreshing over time, they only come back from resting

I'd check this one if I were you, , because it seems to have gone the other way - if my testing is correct, once logging into the server, there is now no limit to the amount of casts per day.

huh. i've had a completely different experience. my casting counter is working perfectly [getting exactly as many casts as are displayed and displaying as many as i should have] and regen of epic spells over time is working correctly for me. also, casting both in and out of combat seems to apply the appropriate die-roll modifiers, and the 'slay' seed also appears to be working.

now, i'll be the first to admit i don't have nearly the experience a lot of others have w/epic spells [*cough*crideas*cough*] and i'll willingly cede to their better judgment, but from my perspective things seem to be working right. i'd say 's done it.

I just had Jane cast and cast and cast and cast ... even changed up the spells she cast (and accidentally killed her in the process [oops! forgot which slot was 'Renewal of Life!' and which was 'Shock Tongue!']), and it made no difference ... never saw the 'can't cast any more spells' message we used to get.

aha, that explains the player corpse named 'dead jane' i tripped over in the astral conjunction when i logged in...

[Eric of Atrophy]

Hmm ... I dunno ... I'll give it another shot, and see if anything is changed ... maybe Jane is just that much of a freak!

[titus]

maybe the spell counters aren't actually initialized until after you exit the astral conjunction? [i'm assuming that since i saw the bodybag in the a.c. that you tested there too]

[The Amethyst Dragon]

I'll look into those. I've got the toolset open right now.

I just finished up several days of model work for reworking the spell research. Gone will be the large statues you have to walk forever to get through to what you want (some of which don't seem to work properly due to deeply buried "use" nodes). In will be a compact "stand in one place and click options" system...I just had to get through the tedium of making 222 new placeable models for it (just small planes with text on them, but it gets old fast).

The new system will have the Spellcraft DCs in the names of the options placeables (when you mouse over them) and will have things like saving throw types and durations in their descriptions for when you examine them. I'm also going to have several options constantly visible (finalize: skip to end and try to research, review: check current options, spellcraft DC, and costs, and start over/exit: cancel out of research and jump back to the portal back to the library).

I'm just working my way through remaking the options placeables now, with varying tags so that the system can properly reveal and hide appropriate options (such as not even showing the fortify and vitality seeds for non-priest epic casters and the destroy and energy ones for non-arcane epic casters).

Progress is being made, just not live yet....since I realized the work I'm doing will break the old research system as I switch from "use a placeable" to "click a placeable" (and the fact that I deleted all of the older options statues and waypoints from the library area so that the toolset will work much faster for me). I did make a backup of the entire area, but I'd rather not try to restore it unless I accidentally completely kill the ability to research epic spells with the new stuff.

The new research system will use the same exact stored variables as the older one, so previously researched epic spells will still function (or not) as they currently do. I'm not rewriting the entire system from scratch, but rebuilding the research part in an easier to use and more informative way.

Epic casts available should be returning over time. I've got some minor tweaking to do on the timing, but it should be working. I'll check on what effects death might be having on messing up the record keeping (it's tracked with two stored variables and incrementing/decrementing a feat's uses, all based on the class levels, spellcraft base ranks, and casting of epic spells).

If anyone is wondering, here's the texture used for all of the new placeables. Should make the things much easier to use, eh?

[titus]

yo, , you are the greatest! that sounds awesome!
i can hardly wait to sink my claws into that...

[Eric of Atrophy]

Sounds good, except that last part, the text and images you've given are all garbled, I can't quite understand exactly what was going on there.

The issue i experienced with jane was both pre- and post-death, so i don't know if that was a factor ... i'm off to aenea now to see if anything has changed.

[The Amethyst Dragon]

Sounds good, except that last part, the text and images you've given are all garbled, I can't quite understand exactly what was going on there.

Sorry about the picture. I just posted it so those that might be interested could see. It's a copy of the actual single texture image used for all the new "epic magic research" models. I basically just made a single plane, laid the texture on it, then cut out individual rectangles that exactly match the texture. So one model will have just "Review" on it, one will have just "+12 Str" on it, etc.

It'll all make much more sense when the system is put together and functional. All you'll end up seeing in-game are the options you can currently pick from....1st it will be just the seed categories your character can use (afflict, armor, conceal, etc.), 2nd will be the specific effects of the single seed you clicked on in the 1st step, 3rd (and onward) will be only the options that apply for that specific effect. The final list of options (after you've picked any modifiers) will be only Start Over/Exit, Review, and Finalize. The goal is to make it as smooth and easy as possible.

[Eric of Atrophy]

Ah, ok, I see what you're saying! Sounds coolio, can't wait to give it a spin!

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